Leslie4: I believe that each person reaches the end of their medical infertility journey and moves to adoption in a very personal timing.

  Shannon H: How long do families usually take, on average, to come to the decision to adopt after infertility has been ascertained?

  Leslie4: Some move to adoption after the second miscarriage, some after one trial of clomid, and some after 5-7 years of IVF. There is really not an average time,

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  Shannon H: In many cases, both individuals, if part of a couple, don't always reach this decision at the same time. How best to counsel in such a situation?

  Leslie4: Yes, that is a significant problem with many couples. One partner has "had enough" and is ready to get started with adoption, while the other must process the loss of a biological child for a longer period. Just getting them to talk together and recognize their differences is vital.

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  Shannon H: What are some of the issues that couples or individuals need to be self-aware of in deciding whether they are ready for adoption? How can they be counseled not to try to push the other into a decision they are not ready to make?

  Leslie4: They must recognize their individual timing in the grief process, and while difficult need to support their partner in whaterver timing is necessary for getting through the intense part of grief from the loss of a biological child. Remembering that not only is it unfair to the slower-pace spouse, but also to an infant who does not need to come into a house full of depression.

  Shannon H: How much of an influence is extended family or friends when making this vital decision? The support system, or lack thereof, must be a crucial part of the decision making process, right?

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  Leslie4: Yes, it is. Unfortunately, more often than not, family and friends encourage adoption prior to the couple being ready. It is uncomfortable seeing your loved ones in pain, so adoption is often suggested before the couple is emotionally ready. But the good news is that the family & friends are truly there to support the couple, if the couple can let them know what would be most helpful.

  chatadmin: Leslie, How do you help the person who is struggling with feelings of inadequacy either the male or the female?

  Leslie4: Again, the importance of acknowledging that infertility is one of the few illnesses in which the person with the illness feels responsible for having it! Just talking that dilemma through and talking with other people in similar circumstances is useful

  Veda: Leslie, let's say we have a couple who have had a child placed with them for the purpose of adoption; what triggers might you prepare them for that might trigger unresolved issues to present themselves and impact the placement?

  Leslie4: Comments on how much the baby looks like them, often triggers that pain of wondering how a biological child would have looked. Or some rude comment about having a 'child of your own'. Unfortunately, people can be insensitive.

  Shannon H: What would be the best type of counseling for families in this process? Alot of factors are involved. Would there be several components to look at? Where should they begin?

  Veda: Leslie, if a single parent is reading this and infertility is one of the reasons they are adopting, what might they need to be aware of as their child grows and develops...say a female child going into puberty?

  Leslie4: Shannon, I try to tell folks that is impossible to get all their grief work finished prior to adoption, But it is important to read a good bit about infertility and it's after-effects.

  Leslie4: Veda, A single person is not as likely to be sufferinfg from the pain of infertility, so just doing a good preparation about adoption and single parenthood (which is it's own challenge) is where I would focus.

  Shannon H: I would imagine loss and grief first and foremost, and possibly marital counseling. Infertility can create such stress in a couple, especially if one person is still beating themselves up. Have you seen this very often?

  Leslie4: Yes, very frequently. Infertility is the most stressful disease there is following only cancer. I tell people this so they can know the magnitude of what they are dealing with. And loss and grief are the predominant feelings. Jealousy is another feeling often reported.

  Leslie4: Marital therapy should be mandatory.

  metro: How long would you suggest someone attend family counseling?

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  Leslie4: I see many couples through the course of their infertility treatment. Most infertility clinics are making a recommendation for the couple to attend therapy. Not necessarily each and every week, but at some frequency that works.

  Leslie4: a group that is recommended for people on the infertility journey.

  Leslie4: Woops, that group is called RESOLVE.

  Shannon H: I have often heard the term that families need to "resolve their infertility" before entering into the adoption process. But is this really possible? I don't know that infertility is ever really completely "resolved", but I do know families who have reached a good understanding of what they need to continue on. What are your thoughts? Is there ever a finality to this issue?

  Judy: How do you help a family cope with the fear of an adoption disrupting due to biological family deciding against adoption after placement.

  Leslie4: No, I see it as a life long process. Often when a couple becomes grandparents via their adopted child, some grief get's set off again. I think it is just another burden to put on a couple, to give them the message thet should finishnthe grief process before adoption.

  Shannon H: RESOLVE is a wonderful resource to families. Can you talk just a bit more about what they offer, for those who might never have heard of them? Can they help with things such as what Judy describes?

  Leslie4: The actuality of that occuring is infinitely small. The birthmother only has 10 days in which to change her mind (in the state of Ga.) and then the decision cannot be recinded. It is true though, that pre-adopting couples must be prepared that a mother planning adoption might change her mind after the infant is born. So it is important to be hopeful, but keep the knowledge that it could fall through before the adoption takes place.

  Leslie4: Resolve offers much to people suffering from infertility. They help support people as they look at the variety of choices left to them. i.e. going further with medical interventions, deciding to make peace with living childless, or educating about all the joy and some of the concerns around adoption.

  Leslie4: They have monthly information seminars, support groups, and individual support people available. They also do an annual conference on adoption.

  Shannon H: Do they assist families who are considering whether to adopt domestically, internationally and transculturally/transracially? I know of many couples seeking information on this type of concern.

  DanaW: - has left the chat -

  Leslie4: Yes, the many members who have ended up adopting will offer a wealth of information, as well as the annual adoption conference. They bring in experts to speak about the many different aspects of adoption.

  Shannon H: I understand your practice offers adoptee counseling as well as reunification possibilities, but please correct me if that is wrong. That is a vital part of adoption no matter where the placement comes from. At what point is this introduced to couples seeking to adopt? It seems so far down the road for families adopting young ones, but really needs to be brought to the fore fairly early on, I would think.

  Veda: - has left the chat -

  Leslie4: Yes I do run a search and support group for adult adoptees and I often reunite minor adoptees upon their parents request.

  Veda: - has joined the chat -

  Leslie4: more people continue to utilize 'open adoption.' The good news is that we do not have to worry about the "reunioun aspect". The sooner adoptive parents understand that is an inevitable part of the adoption process, the better it is for the adoptee.

  Shannon H: I imagine this might be a point that would resurface the grief issue for families. How can this be assuaged and how can families be strengthened by what they might see as a threat to their family? Not all see it that way, but if they do..... what then?

  Leslie4: There is only one set of parents "and those are the ones that are there day in and day out.

  Shannon H: True. Well, we are closing in on the end of our hour. Does anyone have any last thoughts or questions?

  Leslie4: But it is hard for poeople to always trust in that fact, because it does trigger their old dormant grief. The message that I try to give all adoptive parents is that they are uniquely created to be parents for children who will have also suffered that biological "disconnection." The two are mirror opposites, if that makes sense.

  Shannon H: Thank you, Leslie, for a very informative and thought-provoking topic. How can people reach you for more information?

  Veda: - has left the chat -

  Leslie4: my website is www.lesliepatemackinnon.com Thank you so much for letting me participate with you on this discussion.

  Shannon H: Thank you! I know you have helped alot of people tonight!