with Vilda Brannen, MS, LPC

Monday, the 8th of September 2008

KimW: I would like to welcome tonight Vilda Brannen,MS,LPC,NCC, she is the Adoptive Mother of a child with Bipolar Disorder and a Therapist with Crown Councseling & Psychological Services . Welcome Vilda .

vbrannen: Thank you

KimW: Vilda is here to chat with us about tools for Loving & Supporting the Adopted Child

CindyS: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: Just a bit of back ground regarding bipolar disorder and children

vbrannen: Bipolar is a diagnosis of exclusion

vbrannen: Meaning we must first rule out unipolar despression

CindyS: what is unipolar?

vbrannen: Most kids don't say they are sad. They act bad or mad!

vbrannen: Unipolar is what we all know of as regular depression

KimW: Is there a higher rate of bipolar children that are adopted?

vbrannen: Many children diagnosed with depression usually go on to be diagnosed later with bipolar disorder

vbrannen: Most likely. There tends to be a higher rate of ADHD in adoptive children

KimW: What are some symptom's of bipolar disorder in children?

cathy: - has joined the chat -

Amys Place: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: 93 % of these ADHD Kids end up with a possible bipolar dx

vbrannen: Symptoms include hyperactivity which is goal directed

Amys Place: I have read something about that %

vbrannen: Grandiosity- center of the universe

Mirage: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: Adression which is severe/violent

vbrannen: This is sometimes directed toward others or themselves

Amys Place: I have an 18 year step daughter, she went biazarre about a year ago...up down lies manipulations aggression blame

chatadmin: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: I would look at decreased need for sleep and mood swings

vbrannen: This is accompanied by impulsive and risky behaviors

CindyS: what sents bipolar apart from ADHD?

vbrannen: These children have very poor insight about how their behaviors effect others

KimW: The violence you were talking about could that be in a temper tamtrum ?

vbrannen: Let me outline some differences. This will take a few lines so hang in here with me

vbrannen: Destructiveness: ADHD careless/BP angry

vbrannen: Tantrums ADHD/minutes BP/hours

vbrannen: Danger ADHD/oblivious BP/intentional risk taking

KimW: So a child with Bipolar could rage for hours

Shannon H: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: Sexuality ADHD/ age appropriate BP/shocking hypersexuality

vbrannen: Problem behaviors ADHD/ most likely at school/BP/ most likely at home

vbrannen: Hyperactivity ADHD/aimless BP/goal directed

CindyS: what type of tests are given to determine bipolar?

cathy: At what age can a child be diagnosed with this disorder?

vbrannen: Kim, a child can rage for hours

vbrannen: Cindy, the diagnosis is usually based on looking at behaviors and patterns. There is no specific test

vbrannen: Children are now being diagnosed as early as 5-6 years old. The sooner the better

CindyS: can these test vary depending on the mood of the child taking the test at the time of the test?

vbrannen: Taking a close look at a child's family history is one the greatest helps

KimW: Why is it better to diagnose at a young age?

vbrannen: Those types of tests are influenced by the mood of the child

vbrannen: We know the fewer episodes of mania and depression one experiences the better the long term outcome

vbrannen: The most important thing of all is the right diagnosis by a psychiatrist or counselor

Shannon H: What is usually the first mode of treatment once a diagnosis has been made?

DanaW: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: Medications are the first and most important treatments

Mirage: Who do you think is the best professional to use to make this diagnosis, i.e. Psychiatrist vs. Psychologist.

vbrannen: This depends on the knowledge and expertise of the particular provider.

Judy: - has joined the chat -

vbrannen: Establishing routines and good sleep patterns are the next most important interventions

Shannon H: What factors of BP do the meds treat first?

lgrimes38: - has joined the chat -

KimW: Are there any parenting techniques that work better with bipolar children ?

Amys Place: are the behaviors between BP and Personality Disorder closely related?

vbrannen: Diet and exercise play an important role

Mirage: You used psychiatrist or counselor above; what type of counselor were you referring to? Parents often get confused when we don't clarify the type of professional that should be sought out for a diagnosis.

CindyS: what type of meds are given?

vbrannen: Listen, Empathize, Agree, Partner--even if agreeing means to agree to disagree

CindyS: are there certain types of foods or ingredients that should be eliminated from their diet?

vbrannen: Meds commonly prescribed are mood stabilizers as opposed to antidepressants

vbrannen: A licensed professional counselor, licensed clinical social worker, a licensed psychologist or a medical doctor would all be able to make a diagnosis if they have the background and training

cathy: If a child is diagnosed early, will that child have to take meds as an adult?

vbrannen: Foods which containe caffiene should be eliminated. These kids crave carbohydrates and sometimes this causes weight gain which adds to the problem

vbrannen: Early diagnosis does not mean a cure. There is not a cure at this time. Hopefully with the medications, counseling and a good support system the child will develop skills of coping and managing this illness as an adult

Judy: Is there a genetic link to bipolar?

vbrannen: Many of my clients are between the ages of 18 -25 the most common time to be diagnosed. They are attending colleges and technical schools and learning to take chare of this illness rather than it taking charge of them

KimW: If a mother has taken drugs during pregnancy, does that have any influence on a child with bipolar?

Shannon H: Is there any certain reason carbs are craved? That seems to be prevalent in alot of disorders.

vbrannen: Helping children accept this diagnosis is important

vbrannen: Drugs taken while a baby in in the womb do not cause bipolar disorder as this is a genetic illness. Drugs can cause early onset of the illness in children

vbrannen: Carbs tend to be comfort foods for all of us and these children are no different. They sometimes eat to help with their emotions.

KimW: What is the youngest onset of this disorder that you know of?

vbrannen: Probably the youngest I have seen is 6 yrs of age. The major thing is onset is usually a traumatic event that causes stress and the onset.

CindyS: there seems to be an overlap of ADHDand Bipolar symtoms, and we most often don't have any family history to guide us, can you give some suggestions that are families can use to help seek the right professional?

vbrannen: With adopted children, the traumatic event can be separation from a birthmother

Judy: My 14 & 13 year old's biological mother has bipolar disorder, should there be specific things that I watch for?

vbrannen: I would suggest looking at the Childhood Bipolar Foundation website and they possibly have some referral sources. Bipolar has just become a more prevalent diagnosis and so there are not many specialist in this area. Ask

KimW: The Bipolar child is a great book and we have it in our Library at the Center.

vbrannen: There is about a 30% chance of a child with a mother who has a bipolar diagnosis being diagnosed with the disorder

CindyS: can this be pass genetically from the father?

vbrannen: Depression is the first symptom of bipolar disorder. Making sure your children are not prescribed antidepressants with a family history of bipolar disorder is the most important thing you need to do

vbrannen: Actually, the rate of passing on the genetics seems to be higher when the father has a bipolar diagnosis. We don't know why yet

KimW: What happens when a bipolar child takes antidepressants?

vbrannen: Antidepressants can trigger a manic episode for someone who has a bipolar depression vs. a unipolar depression. Just making sure the diagnosis is correct before proceding is so important.

vbrannen: My favorite book for families with members who have bipolar disorder is Take Charge of Bipolar by Julie Fast. It is the best around.

vbrannen: Ms. Fast has bipolar disorder herself and really gives the best guidelines and advice to families.

KimW: We are coming to the end of our chat does anyone have any last minute questions?

vbrannen: Also seeking support at places like the Depression and Bipolar Support Alliance is helpful here in ATlanta

vbrannen: Kim I am sure I have only opened the door to many questions. I can be reached to follow up on questions at This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it

Amys Place: thank you

KimW: Thank you for coming Ms. Brannen this was a great chat with wonderful information.

cathy: Thanks, this was great information!

vbrannen: I also want to say these children can be the most challenging, but the most rewarding if given the love, support and treatment they need. Many of the great people in our history have this diagnosis

Amys Place: I learned today that a lot of famous inventors, etc had mental illenss

CindyS: thanks, you really opened up some doors, great information

vbrannen: These are creative and out of the box kids, but most have great potential.

KimW: Thanks Everyone for the great questions! Good Nite

vbrannen: Thanks, Kim for hosting!